ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Elite (and related) releases.
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Adeptus Noobus
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Adeptus Noobus » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 3:26 pm

Chaos got every single nerf they deserved and buffs mostly where they were needed. If that is indeed what he is implying then he should get used to Chaos not a-move-deleting units anymore (Plague Marines and Chosen Plague Marines mainly).

EDIT: But this is not the right place for a balance discussion...
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_4ut_
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby _4ut_ » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 5:05 pm

Lost Son of Nikhel wrote:
Adeptus Noobus wrote:And which truth would that be. It was a very genuine question. I do not know what you are getting at.

I suppose he is saying that the ol'n'gud "Chaos OP, pls nerf" motto was being a bit overused in the lastest patches, if we have in mind the buff/nerf ratio. And I agree with him partially. Some changes are needed for the balance sake, others IMHO seems a bit "For the LULZ"

In the worst case, he is insinuating the also ol'n'gud "Z now mains X and that's because he nerfs Y".

Yeap.
Adeptus Noobus wrote:EDIT: But this is not the right place for a balance discussion...

Yeap.

Let's go further. But now we have a Farsight.
Atlas

Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Atlas » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 11:12 pm

See the Ist thread about the melee skill on OM Ist leaders.

Are we seriously considering the ratio of buffs/nerfs as the barometer for the relative strength of factions?
In that case, let's add this to Chaos and help even out that ratio:

Heretic pistol damage increased from 1 to 2.
CSM speed increased from 5 to 5.01.
BC cost decreased from 280/30 to 279/30

and so on and so on.

I'm being a bit facetious here, but I hope my point is being conveyed. The number of buffs/nerfs is insignificant. What matters is the relevance of said buffs/nerfs.
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Adeptus Noobus
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Adeptus Noobus » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 11:24 pm

Atlas wrote:The number of buffs/nerfs is insignificant. What matters is the relevance of said buffs/nerfs.

This is basically it. Nothing else needs to be said.
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby _4ut_ » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 12:09 pm

Atlas wrote:See the Ist thread about the melee skill on OM Ist leaders.

Are we seriously considering the ratio of buffs/nerfs as the barometer for the relative strength of factions?
In that case, let's add this to Chaos and help even out that ratio:

Heretic pistol damage increased from 1 to 2.
CSM speed increased from 5 to 5.01.
BC cost decreased from 280/30 to 279/30

and so on and so on.

I'm being a bit facetious here, but I hope my point is being conveyed. The number of buffs/nerfs is insignificant. What matters is the relevance of said buffs/nerfs.


There is nothing here to sneer.
The median is the average in the hospital. It shows us the statistics. And not how someone become stronger or weaker.
And I still believe that so understand this wall of text easier. Especially easier to understand those who are with us recently.
And yet it would be better that in the first post everything would have been submitted in this form.
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Tinibombini » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 3:05 pm

_4ut_ wrote:There is nothing here to sneer.
The median is the average in the hospital. It shows us the statistics. And not how someone become stronger or weaker.
And I still believe that so understand this wall of text easier. Especially easier to understand those who are with us recently.
And yet it would be better that in the first post everything would have been submitted in this form.


hospital? "so understand this wall of text easier"? statistics?

Talk about the wrong way to try to use statistics (and this "analysis" does not even rise to the level of a misuse of statistics). You have to have a lot of things defined in advance before a statistical analysis. It looks like you have just tallied the buffs and nerfs....this is just ridiculous to begin to use as an understanding of balance. For one, it assumes that every "buff" is equivalent.

edit: strike that about tallying - i don't even know what the hell this spreadsheet is trying to show. It is definitely not a statistical analysis.

Also https://youtu.be/EShUeudtaFg
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Adeptus Noobus
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Adeptus Noobus » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 3:55 pm

I agree with Tini. This is not about absolute numbers of buffs v nerfs. This is about the QUALITY/CONTENT of said changes. The table just shows absolute numbers of changes and it seems you are trying to suggest that "some" factions got hit too hard with the nerf hammer. This is simply not the case. Making changes in any direction (nerf or buff) is about CONVERGING to a state where all factions are more or less balanced in their matchups. Next patch for example GK are going to get the nerfhammer hard, but why is that? Because they are overperforming massively in some areas right now. If you take those changes out of the continuity of past changes, then you are going to come to the conclusion that somebody really hates GK and nerfed them into the ground going by absolute numbers. It just doesn't work that way. Can we get past this now?!

P.S: I fixed the coloring of the rotation rate changes for you because you got them backward.

P.P.S: Please try to ask a friend to look over your translations because it is next to impossible to understand what you are saying.
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Torpid » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 4:13 pm

Put simply the insinuation that all races were roughly balanced in 2.5 equally is wrong.

Chaos were blatantly overpowered, as were tyranids. Hence why both races received overall large nerfs.

SM on the other hand were under-performing and required fantastic play with no mistakes to win at the highest levels vs pretty much every other race. Hence the disproportionate buffs.

Thus we arrive at the state we are at now. With a tweaked IG/ork/eldar to be more fitting to the game design of those races.

If there are indeed accusations of bias towards any particular race then raise them specifically in a different thread and question my changes and I will address that questioning. The race I play the least is by far chaos. So perhaps chaos are at risk of getting over-nerfed for that reason. Yet I try my best to consult as many people as possible on the changes I make and not just making them based on a whim I feel after playing two games or so... Also, despite playing chaos so rarely I can still play chaos at a very high level. So it's not like the analysis is doomed to be entirely off...
Lets make Ordo Malleus great again!
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_4ut_
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby _4ut_ » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 4:42 pm

Read
the wall
of text
easier
with
color-coded.
It is very difficult to understand? Religious considerations forbid to do it?
Yes it troling. You can ban.
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Swift
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Swift » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 6:07 pm

Image
The internal battery has run dry, the game can now be played. However, clock based events will no longer occur.
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Forestradio
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Forestradio » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 11:30 pm

Lost Son of Nikhel wrote:Some changes are needed for the balance sake, others IMHO seems a bit "For the LULZ"

Wrong, most of the chaos "nerfs" are simply changes that revert the completely unneeded buffs they received in the first place... bloodletters at 12 pop? 15 pop preds? pms countering everything?

None of those were needed in the first place, so no it's not an overnerf, it's a revert to a previous state where they were fine.

Not all factions were in the same place last patch, hence not all of them received the same amount of changes.
Last edited by Forestradio on Sat 24 Dec, 2016 3:33 am, edited 2 times in total.
Tinibombini
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Tinibombini » Sat 24 Dec, 2016 12:27 am

Forest, fix your quoting. Noobus would never say such a silly thing (and he didn't).
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Adeptus Noobus
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Adeptus Noobus » Sat 24 Dec, 2016 12:29 am

Tinibombini wrote:Forest, fix your quoting. Noobus would never say such a silly thing (and he didn't).

Thank you. I am a little drunk right now but I never said such a silly thing. Especially since I agree with you here Forest.
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Cheekie Monkie » Sun 25 Dec, 2016 1:10 pm

Forestradio wrote:LA is by far my favourite hero in the game.


These misquotes are really getting out of hand.
Playing truth or dare with Diomedes: You dare? YOU DARE?!
Tinder with Diomedes: THINK YOU ARE MY MATCH?!
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Malal
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Malal » Tue 27 Dec, 2016 3:56 pm

Hi there!

I'm new here, and haven't played DOW2 for years. I loved the idea of a new mod and wanted to try it out.
Unfortunately I keep getting "an error occurred" messages when I try to launch any of the gamemods in ELITE.

I can play single-player and private custom multiplayer in the regular version of Retribution, but I can't play anything in ELITE. The only thing I can access is basically the chat and army painter :(

Can someone help me out? I have been looking all over the web for a while now, but no one seems to have had this problem in years.

Please help and save my holidays :)

Cheers from Denmark
Thunderhost
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby Thunderhost » Wed 28 Dec, 2016 3:01 pm

When you install the mod, be aware that there's a separate shortcut for elite installed. That may be your issue. Otherwise I'll hav to refer you to the tech priests.
cannedbeans
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Re: ELITE Mod 2.6 Release Thread

Postby cannedbeans » Tue 31 Jan, 2017 1:16 pm

In the ladder, though similar in rank/points/skill, everybody is playing a different race, showcasing a well-balanced game. Look at the top ten for example. It's not just one race a-moving. Kudos to the Devs and lets keep playing this game!

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