Vengeance Devs vs Shieldwall TG

[oh my!]

I noticed the other day during a game that Devastator Vengeance rounds didn't seem to be having the effect that they should be on a TG with Shieldwall up. Following that, I ran a good, old-fashioned lab. The lab is attached to this post, but the gist is: Vengeance rounds do absolutely sod-all to a Shieldwall TG, even at point-blank range.

Is this WAI? If not, can one of the mod team have a bit of a look at it, please?

2p_typhonswamp.2014-07-23.01-20-28.rec

(273.29 KiB) Downloaded 211 times

[Swift]

It may have to do with the TG having vehicle armour, since in shieldwall it gets vehicle nd vengeance rounds are soft av at best.

[Ace of Swords]

Pointblank vengeance round are supposed to kill something like a transport in about 3-4 seconds, so it should be do enough damage to kill off a halfhp shieldwalled TG at point blank.

[oh my!]

Indeed. The raw AV DPS of point-blank Vengeance Devs is about 104DPS (barring size modifiers etc). As you'll see from my lab, they knock about 700HP of a carnifex strolling around in front of them. They do *nothing* to a Shieldwall TG. Sweet Fanny Adams.

[Nuclear Arbitor]

shield wall has crazy regen though. i'm not sure what it is (not 104) but it would certainly reduce the damage.

[Torpid]

Shieldwall needs a nerf even if this is a bug.

[Black Relic]

I never noticed this. I figure it was because of health regen.

Shieldwall needs a nerf even if this is a bug.

Best nerf would be to halt energy regen during this mode. Or at least reduce energy regen. a bit.

[Caeltos]

I guess it's conflicting modifiers of some sort.

[Aertes]

Best nerf would be to halt energy regen during this mode. Or at least reduce energy regen. a bit.

I think Shield wall should cost energy while active. Maybe not too much, something that allowed the Guard to stay like that for a good amount of time, but not forever.

[Superhooper01]

The sheildwall re-gen is bit crazy agree with Torpid

[oh my!]

I think there's room for both Shieldwall being a touch OTT *and* this being a bug of some description. Sheildwall regen is 10hp/sec - not insignificant, but not enough to seriously dent the amount of damage that point-blank Vengeance rounds ought to be doing.

Haven't got any grand ideas for a rework of Shieldwall myself - perhaps we could have another thread for that, given that this one seems to be running it's course?

[Myrdal]

Indeed. The raw AV DPS of point-blank Vengeance Devs is about 104DPS (barring size modifiers etc). As you'll see from my lab, they knock about 700HP of a carnifex strolling around in front of them. They do *nothing* to a Shieldwall TG. Sweet Fanny Adams.

If that's the actual dps then it's no surprise it takes no damage since you didn't take into account the %25 accuracy modifier against large creatures seen here. The tg heals for 25hp/s in shield wall. What's strange is that it only does 100dps, it should be doing around 150 I think. Does it really destroy a razorback 3-4s?

[Tex]

I just destroyed an upgraded rhino in 3 bursts with vengeance rounds. So gratifying to get good use out of the libby and VRdevs.

[M4573R_CH13f]

it should still be noticeable. the devs do 600 damage in one volley of 2 second. 75% vengeance rounds damage buff and 2.75 multiplier for short range, 0.25 accuracy vs large targets, 0.2 damage multiplier
--> 144 damage in 2 second, 77 in one. that does easily outgun the healthregen of 20hp/s

[Myrdal]

72, but you're right. Not sure if the problem is with tg or VR devs. Any other issues with either? How does VR work on say a WL?

[lolzarz]

Tyrant guards have 5 times the health of an upgraded rhino, so it obviously takes more time to kill. Then you have shield wall that gives 20 regeneration, that rhinos obviously don't have. The devastator deals 216.39(quoting codex here)x0.02(vehicle armour)x7(vengeance rounds)=39DPS (not sure if base 75% damage buff stacks with 900% damage buff vs vehicles). The Rhino takes the full 39 DPS. Tyrant guards, due to 20 regeneration, take 19 DPS. That's halved damage on a unit with 5x health.