Vehicles Dominating Metas

Issues dealing with gameplay balance.
User avatar
Element
Level 3
Posts: 269
Joined: Wed 30 Apr, 2014 4:44 am
Location: "A place you are just unable to fathom"

Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby Element » Tue 02 Nov, 2021 4:32 am

I don't know about you but my last few games despite wiping troop units just ends in vehicle spam, of which they are literally just rolling over invested troop infantry based factions, those which have little to or inferior vehicles in comparison to the opposition. It really needs to be talked about. it's really killing the game to an extent. I mean av was meant to counter maybe (1 or 2 vehicles) not 3 or 4 over the course of 1 game. it just doesn't work composition wise, Troop Movement for time wise regarding investment, and skirmish for loss ratio value wise in relations to just being able to store up mass amounts of resources because you aren't bleeding anything. It's really killing the game if I'm to be honest. I dont want this to turn into one of those games where vehicles are all that matter in the game.
"The meaning of life is to have purpose, and the purpose of life is what you choose to make of it, in addition to what you come to understand along the way."

"Because I choose to."

"The humble person knows not everything, nor nothing at all, but certainly something worth knowing."
User avatar
TE | NoSkill
Level 3
Posts: 235
Joined: Wed 27 Jul, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby TE | NoSkill » Tue 02 Nov, 2021 10:15 am

Yeah, vehicles are really strong if you support them right, due to several reasons;

- your repair-squads can repair AND fight at the same time ( so you don t have to stop and repair)
- your hard-counter AV ( las-cannons) can often be matched in range by vehicles AND/OR disrupted.
- you do have little area denial (mines are mostly hero-specific/ field fortifications against vehicles are non-existent)
- there are no critical hits on vehicles like in Company of heroes ( engine damage/ main-gun destroyes/ tracks destroyed etc)
User avatar
Dark Riku
Level 5
Posts: 3082
Joined: Sun 03 Feb, 2013 10:48 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby Dark Riku » Wed 03 Nov, 2021 10:27 am

That's a very interesting take you have there Element, because If anything I find the opposite to be more true.
I feel like vehicles are usually a huge risk. They do not get the "safety" of a retreat button.
Once a vehicle is caught out of position it's usually done for. It doesn't even has to be out of position if you can make a proper assault against it.
Depending on the vehicle, once it is gone it leaves a big dent in your opponents economy and army composition.
Maybe if you provide some replays people could give you some insight in what went wrong in your games?

TE | NoSkill wrote:- your repair-squads can repair AND fight at the same time ( so you don t have to stop and repair)
This isn't entirely true. Sluggas for example will provide you nothing while repairing.
And once you go for multiple vehicles like Element is finding problematic it's hard to keep them repaired for most races.
Commanders that can repair and IG usually being the exception, IG especially with a repair bunker.
initialmink
Level 1
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue 29 Dec, 2020 7:19 am

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby initialmink » Wed 03 Nov, 2021 1:08 pm

Element wrote:I don't know about you but my last few games despite wiping troop units just ends in vehicle spam, of which they are literally just rolling over invested troop infantry based factions, those which have little to or inferior vehicles in comparison to the opposition. It really needs to be talked about. it's really killing the game to an extent. I mean av was meant to counter maybe (1 or 2 vehicles) not 3 or 4 over the course of 1 game. it just doesn't work composition wise, Troop Movement for time wise regarding investment, and skirmish for loss ratio value wise in relations to just being able to store up mass amounts of resources because you aren't bleeding anything. It's really killing the game if I'm to be honest. I dont want this to turn into one of those games where vehicles are all that matter in the game.



send us a reply!remember that av level 4 vs vehicle level 1 is very lethal!
Cave canem
User avatar
Element
Level 3
Posts: 269
Joined: Wed 30 Apr, 2014 4:44 am
Location: "A place you are just unable to fathom"

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby Element » Wed 03 Nov, 2021 5:37 pm

Here's a couple
------------------
-https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/50160405

https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/50148717


Edit (Adds)
-----
https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/50186680
Last edited by Element on Thu 04 Nov, 2021 10:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"The meaning of life is to have purpose, and the purpose of life is what you choose to make of it, in addition to what you come to understand along the way."

"Because I choose to."

"The humble person knows not everything, nor nothing at all, but certainly something worth knowing."
initialmink
Level 1
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue 29 Dec, 2020 7:19 am

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby initialmink » Thu 04 Nov, 2021 8:38 am

Element wrote:Here's a couple
------------------
-https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/50160405

https://dawnofwar.info/esl/match/50148717

i have watched the replay, your opponent got 2 bloodcrusher and u was still t1.....u couldn't win that match!
Cave canem
User avatar
Element
Level 3
Posts: 269
Joined: Wed 30 Apr, 2014 4:44 am
Location: "A place you are just unable to fathom"

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby Element » Thu 04 Nov, 2021 10:04 am

i have watched the replay, your opponent got 2 bloodcrusher and u was still t1.....u couldn't win that match!

Yes you can, He couldn't make use of them. and I was able to aquire the proper counters for them. and it was 1 at the end of T1. Please use the right context
"The meaning of life is to have purpose, and the purpose of life is what you choose to make of it, in addition to what you come to understand along the way."

"Because I choose to."

"The humble person knows not everything, nor nothing at all, but certainly something worth knowing."
User avatar
daddy E
Level 1
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed 24 Feb, 2021 12:38 pm
Location: ur mom's house

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby daddy E » Wed 10 Nov, 2021 2:54 pm

git gud
Paranoid Kamikaze
Level 4
Posts: 590
Joined: Tue 02 Feb, 2016 5:12 am

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby Paranoid Kamikaze » Wed 10 Nov, 2021 8:38 pm

Fathom, he had 4 vehicles and 1 repair unit. He outplayed you badly.

Don't just spread your units out and try to cap points all over the map cause all he had to do was pick off any of them and then send his full army against whatever you had left on the field. He won every engagement like that.

The tradeoff to fast teching is you have less of an army so you get pushed off and your gens bashed. He fast teched and you didn't punish him at all. A single unupgraded Shoota that didn't even take out a single gen doesn't count. You let him do what he wanted.
User avatar
ArcticFrenzy
Level 1
Posts: 48
Joined: Sun 14 Aug, 2016 4:36 pm

Re: Vehicles Dominating Metas

Postby ArcticFrenzy » Sat 12 Mar, 2022 8:52 am

To support your argument, consider following notes regarding tanks:

- there are issues manouvering tanks across maps, we are grafting tanks to somewhat contradicting base vanilla design.

- tanks support inch-forth & inch-back tactics which may appear sterile,

- i would support giant tanks being left to team games, 3v3 preferably,

- tanks are appearing in increasing number in unit choices,

- W40k universe has much more interesting units than tanks.

Return to “Balance Discussion”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 28 guests