Enlarge elite mod playerbase

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crog
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Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby crog » Sun 24 Dec, 2017 2:11 pm

Hey guys,

I got some ideas / thoughts how we could enlarge our playerbase.

1.) Post on steam (guide) on the official dow2 thread the improvements we got with elite.

A detailed list with pictures, smth like :
a.) new maps
b.) balanced units .. ( write down the most necessary balance changes )
c.) new units + this fkin awesome elite skins!
d.) the most skilled playerbase (elite league)
e.) tournaments for beginners
f.) 2v2 and 1v1 tourneys..
g.) getting casted
more suggestions?

2.) Organize and announce a big 3v3 tournament ( perhaps faction war )

Since the most vanilla players play 3v3s (always on the one same boring map) , we could try to invite them to a 3v3 tourney with maybe a little prize pool.
Casters like Rostam, Indrid, General Gentlements etc could promote and announce the tourney if they are willing to . This would be very important to get some range. The last 3v3 game Indrid posted, had almost 3.000 views.
Yesterday i talked to Impregnable , many people even on elite didn´t even know there was a tourney going. We have to announce it big time!

3.) hunting in vanilla

This point sounds weird but it definately works.
After playing some 1v1 games in vanilla i persuaded the guys to try elite. They didn´t know it existed.
Maybe some other elite gamers could try that if there are no games on elite running. Ofc just a suggestion.

any suggestions?
Yabbaman
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Yabbaman » Sun 24 Dec, 2017 5:40 pm

Yeah well, I am a new player, interested solely in the elite mod. I keep getting kicked and told to fuck off by the elite playerbase. One dude even told me that the game isn't dying, that there's enough people playing and no new players are needed. Go figure.
TharxGamma
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby TharxGamma » Sun 24 Dec, 2017 5:55 pm

There is a few people like that unfortunately, but on the other hand there is plenty of new players. Best options are post on here looking for players, host your own games or ask nicely :D But honestly its only very few people like that 90% Elite player base are really sound and down to earth.
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egewithin
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby egewithin » Sun 24 Dec, 2017 7:51 pm

Yabbaman wrote:Yeah well, I am a new player, interested solely in the elite mod. I keep getting kicked and told to fuck off by the elite playerbase. One dude even told me that the game isn't dying, that there's enough people playing and no new players are needed. Go figure.


That behavior is the reason why Elite community is not growing anymore. There are like 100 guys who keeps playing Elite. Some of them are always there, new long term players joins but then others leaving the game so it keeps at 100. Number is not really important, it's just an example.

The real problem is; this is not something special to Elite, all of DoW 2 community acts like this. Look at retail, always same '' +60 '' lobbies with overplayed maps, hosted by the same nick name who keeps playing for last 10 years or whatever. Elite is not growing, same with retail. And this is the reason why I call this game dead. It is done, it is not growing anymore. In fact, it's getting smaller. I don't see the same activity on public maps like 2 years ago, or even 1. And the same elitist, perfectionist behavior will always keep it dead untill the end of time.
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Paranoid Kamikaze
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Paranoid Kamikaze » Mon 25 Dec, 2017 12:01 am

People just don't want an unbalanced game. They're not trying to be 'elitist' about it. Some may act rude but it's for the same reason as those trying to be nice and kick you. It's not about hours or rank 60, but those things are checked to make sure the person has played long enough to know the basics. Simply getting a reputation and have people realize you're a good player is enough to guarantee you slots in games meant for experienced players. So, just win some 1v1's against good players and then learn to support your teammates if you're mid and you'll be fine.
Paranoid Kamikaze
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Paranoid Kamikaze » Mon 25 Dec, 2017 12:56 am

Lets all just remind ourselves to spam general chat with messages to download Elite. I can only play this game in the morning because the Europeans are on and it's annoying.
Adila
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Adila » Mon 25 Dec, 2017 11:23 am

People simply give up way to fast this days also, I got raged on allot when I started playing or guys telling me to fuck off or that I am a noob, this is the
moment when you need to focus on yourself and maybe find some of the high lvl guys who actually give you some advice. you cant learn this game in 1 Week and become a pro, it has way to much depth into it, and you new guys need to realize this and go step by step
imo Step1 learn the game mechanics cover % which weapons are good vs what armor what are the weapontypes and armortypes in the game etc, then try
to focus on 1 race first and then build on it. To start you should prefer 3v3 and 2v2 first,then move on to face better players even in 1v1 and work on your
mapcontrole. And never try to be like the guys you hated, so try not to rage at newbies and if its a pro only lobby let him obs if he wishes or tell him nicely that he is not ready yet for this.

If you act positive and helpfull like this and tell some of your friends about this game it will still grow, and nowdays it is possible to learn the game quicker with guides and micro tips etc. Hope it helps a bit.
crog
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby crog » Mon 25 Dec, 2017 12:43 pm

My experience with elite was similar.
I started with 3v3s, was carried or kicked most of the time. However i didn´t give up and wanted to add some value to our team.
Also, playing many 3v3s in retail helped to get the basic game mechanics.

Nowadays I accept new players in my team even if the balance is not given.
I feel like there are more people now trying elite, give them some time and games.

Btw I had also fun playing the pro players even if i know that we will get rekt. Lately the 2v2s vs pheonix and adila, I learned a lot.
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Atlas
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Atlas » Mon 25 Dec, 2017 6:25 pm

Yabbaman wrote:Yeah well, I am a new player, interested solely in the elite mod. I keep getting kicked and told to fuck off by the elite playerbase. One dude even told me that the game isn't dying, that there's enough people playing and no new players are needed. Go figure.


I've heard this happen a lot and it's retarded that it happens at all. Maybe this is just a different mindset for me or something, but if people just say they are new I don't mind getting crushed in team games with them. I consider 3v3s to be the casual game mode so who cares.

Things like this comment are the big reason behind the Last Stand incorporation imo. We give players another avenue to just enjoy the game and not have to deal with Elite bittervets that really ruin the new player experience. Of the list granted, I think casting/tournaments remains the best way to get people involved. Balance is just an eternal war that will never die and will ultimately never be solved. The rest require specialized people to work on them that we just don't have reliably.

To that end, I really appreciate the work that guys like Rostam and Impregnable have done, among many others. I used to be a guy that focused on the ultra-competitive aspects, but I've come to understand the value that newbies bring. All of these are good ideas and this is a good discussion.

10/10 would read this thread again later.
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zemanjaski1
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby zemanjaski1 » Tue 26 Dec, 2017 8:43 am

I got into it through Indrid & Rostam on YouTube and I know a few other people who did the same - I think we need more support of newer players and some time / energy spent on resources for new players to help them get started. It's very intimidating to join a community where it seems like everyone else has been playing for 5-6 years more than you; so some build order or strategy guides, or perhaps something as simple as some POV replays made by the better players explaining some fundamentals.

The rookie tournaments are a great idea, they should be run through this site to help bring people here & get them to mingle.

And yeah, consolidating all of the discords into one would be best.
Paranoid Kamikaze
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Paranoid Kamikaze » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 6:17 am

I have knowledge of making guides from GR so I can make a beginners guide. Will probably take me a few days/weeks depending on how much time per day I end up putting into it.

Other things that need to be done:

- Guide on how to cast games pinned to Gen Discussion and added to Steam Guides
- Guide on how to livestream pinned to Gen Discussion and added to Steam Guides
- Guide on how to make maps pinned to Gen Discussion and added to Steam Guides
- Pinned topics in Gen discussion cleaned up so it's not so bulky
- Need marketing. Spam chat in-game and Reddit(https://www.reddit.com/r/dawnofwar/). That Elite mod exists and any new events
- Better event coverage. Make it easier for people to know about it and spam it in more places
- Find ways to fix sound bug. The most patient person on Earth must talk with people suffering from it and try things to help them until it's fixed
- Fix setup teams setting up showing in the Fog of War so I don't freak out and think people are map hacking when I use Devs aggressively and it doesn't work
- Somebody needs to teach Cornholio how to meditate. Because there's no point in increasing the playerbase if he scares them all away :lol:

Anyways, pick any jobs that you can do and do well. I want enthusiasm. Even if you picked a spam job

Our most popular GROS(GameReplays Open Season) tournament was the one where we left a preformatted post on every DoW fansite there was and I spammed ingame chat multiple times every day for over a week. Viewership was over double.
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Impregnable
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Impregnable » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 7:42 am

In case of guides, I am making a bunch of video guides. Have been preparing for it since summer and it is ready to be recorded and rolled out. In 1 or 2 weekish time.
zemanjaski1
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby zemanjaski1 » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 8:11 am

Oh that's excellent guys. I don't have any coding or design skills but I used to write guides & do commentary for the old wc3replays.com (you can search youtube for d3stroy3r commentaries if you wanna see) and will help where I can (once I am more competent at the game).

Very exciting to see how much is coming - keep up the excellent work!
Reg9678
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Reg9678 » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 2:26 pm

In my opinion, atleast some players in this community need to get rid of their toxic language. Yesterday, I was playing a round of 3v3 against Grand Piano, Uncle Waagh and someone else. Especially Piano was being toxic and salty as f***, resulting in this 1v1 after they lost the team game: https://www.dawnofwar.info/esl/match/31859047
Here he continued this behaviour.

While I'm pretty sure most of this is trolling being this toxic surely won't make new players want to stay and learn. These 3 acted like a bunch of twelve year olds, Piano being their boss and the other 2 being his "yes-sayer" and echo. It was a really pathetic display and those are some quite known players with some representation on YouTube. Most likely they would be the same towards new players, maybe directly exclude after mocking them. To be honest, you'd think that such an old game with a very small community would be much more mature and helpful and not worse than in retail.
Zeno
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Zeno » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 3:56 pm

Reg9678 wrote:In my opinion, atleast some players in this community need to get rid of their toxic language.


Yeah, there's a lot of toxicity in this community. It would probably just be better off with out the in game chat, that way, if some angry man child wants to rage at people, he'd have to do it through Steam messaging. You just have to try and leave them to their butthurt, and feel pity for them if anything, they can't be living very fulfilling lives if they're getting so upset about some dead game.
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Impregnable
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Impregnable » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 4:05 pm

Zeno wrote:
Reg9678 wrote:In my opinion, atleast some players in this community need to get rid of their toxic language.


Yeah, there's a lot of toxicity in this community. It would probably just be better off with out the in game chat, that way, if some angry man child wants to rage at people, he'd have to do it through Steam messaging. You just have to try and leave them to their butthurt, and feel pity for them if anything, they can't be living very fulfilling lives if they're getting so upset about some dead game.


Truly the word of a sage.
Vihyungrang
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Vihyungrang » Wed 27 Dec, 2017 8:30 pm

Personally, I've enjoyed watching all the casted games and wouldn't mind giving the game a whirl. I'm not sure how to even begin though. I know some of the mechanics from watching the casts and finding things out from the codex but have zilch playing experience.
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lomors
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby lomors » Thu 28 Dec, 2017 4:04 pm

Hm. What do you think about let's say. List of tutors for beginners? I myself from time to time find a new player who knows absolutely nothing about the game and I we spend some time on some really easy 1v1s just to learn some mechanics etc. Since we don't always find games I think few of us could afford to spend some time with total beginners, trying to make them ready for team games etc? We could make an official thread with list of people who are willing to "take over" 1-2 total beginners, so they have at least someone to write to when they don't understand something. As we are small I think this may actually help because it's really a hard thing for a person to breakthrough the wall of elite players in game or on forums. And sometimes it's a bit harder to ask all the questions here on forums.
Phoenix
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Phoenix » Thu 28 Dec, 2017 6:10 pm

I said this before and I will say this again. The issue is not higher level players's unwillingness to teach people. I and others have 10+ people on their FL investing multiple hours into them by playing with them, explaining the game etc. A week or a month afterwards they quit the game and are never seen again which makes the whole teaching thing a massive time waste. I can't even blame them, interests can change quickly especially when being younger.
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lomors
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby lomors » Thu 28 Dec, 2017 8:44 pm

The fact stays: we are dying species, gentelmen.

The only new player I recognize who managed to git gud and stay is "I Just Want to Die". And I think he did mostly by himself too.
crog
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby crog » Thu 28 Dec, 2017 8:46 pm

Spamming helps a bit, I have got a few new players download the elite mod.
We should get a spamm bot like in wc3. :)

However I think the casters like Rostam Indrid Generals Gentleman should advertise it a bit more after the games. Put a link on and tell people to try it.
TharxGamma
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby TharxGamma » Thu 28 Dec, 2017 8:49 pm

Think Indrid already does?
zemanjaski1
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby zemanjaski1 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 1:10 am

Can anyone explain the distinction between tier 1-3 players to me?

I went 3-1 vs another newer player last night but played Taylor Swift and the skill gap was SHOCKING. Motivating though.
Paranoid Kamikaze
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Paranoid Kamikaze » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 1:31 am

zemanjaski1 wrote:Can anyone explain the distinction between tier 1-3 players to me?

I went 3-1 vs another newer player last night but played Taylor Swift and the skill gap was SHOCKING. Motivating though.


Tier of players? Not sure what you mean by that. The main difference though between experienced and newer players is that experienced players know more of how to take advantage of mistakes and punish harder. Once they get a lead they can just snowball from there. Once you learn how to position units properly and how to counter you'll find you can go against players like Taylor. And there are many players higher than Taylor as well.
zemanjaski1
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby zemanjaski1 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 3:03 am

Tiers was about the ESL; there was mention of league opportunities for tier 2-3 players next time around.
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Dark Riku
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Dark Riku » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 10:02 am

If you open up the players on the ladder, you will see their tier.
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zemanjaski1
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby zemanjaski1 » Fri 29 Dec, 2017 10:14 am

Is there a way I can submit results without using the uploader app then? I get a system error when I try to run it and so am otherwise reliant on others to record our results.
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Dark Riku
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Dark Riku » Sat 30 Dec, 2017 9:19 pm

Not that I know of. The ESL reporter should work. Try to reinstall the app?
Otherwise, check out the technical issue section and maybe make a new post.
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realmslayer
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby realmslayer » Mon 05 Feb, 2018 2:20 am

There are 2 major issues I can think of right now.

1: Holy crap is this community toxic. You have discords and the game chat itself where the loudest people are also the most toxic. This has to be fixed. They drown out the helpful people.

2: There are not enough games to play. I know I stopped playing as much when I kept logging on, completely unable to find a game with someone even remotely my skill level.

3: This one is less of a big deal but still important, but the fact that there is a unit by unit guide, detailing everything from ability/ unit combinations to strategies for retail but not for elite makes retail much easier to get into. Once you are in deep, you can actually make some use of the codex, provided the unit entry you are looking up isn't bugged.
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Re: Enlarge elite mod playerbase

Postby Sternguard » Fri 16 Feb, 2018 8:12 am

realmslayer wrote:There are 2 major issues I can think of right now.

1: Holy crap is this community toxic. You have discords and the game chat itself where the loudest people are also the most toxic. This has to be fixed. They drown out the helpful people.

2: There are not enough games to play. I know I stopped playing as much when I kept logging on, completely unable to find a game with someone even remotely my skill level.



As a brand new player to Elite (played a few games a few months back and just got back...still a proud noob and liability to anyone in team games ;), this is 100% spot on. People like me want to join the community and improve, but we struggle to find even 2+ 1v1s per day, we can only find SOME team games, which are are fun, but less useful to improve, and even then we are often shouted at by everyone else... Makes it hard to stick with the game when whatever you do seems to not work. That being said...hello everyone just got into the community, loving the mod. Emperor bless you

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