First ingame video (it's in German though)

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Cyris
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Cyris » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 4:21 pm

Here's my unscientific breakdown of this thread. I've attempted to edit out repeat points from the same poster, and pretty much skipped all the clearly personal attacks.

Reasons for hate:
MOBA (vague category, but generally big FX, big Gabriel) - 7
Generic hate (no detail, just qq) - 6
Art style (mostly words like cartoon) - 6
No cover - 4
Gabriel Jumping - 4
Looks like an app (seriously?) - 3
Lack of realism (could be combined with gabriel jumping, but they felt different enough) - 3
Pay to win, elite units too strong, basebuilding - 1

Reasons for praise:
Generic - 4
Clean presentation - 3
Haters gotta chill - 2
Too early - 1


In short, I'm confident in saying that the ELITE forums generally dislike DoW3 so far because of MOBA influences and a lack of realism.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Swift » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 4:49 pm

Oh seriously, if this isn't off-topic I don't know what is. Terminator armour doing somersaults, however immersion breaking it is, it's causing a lot of fuss that is quite unneccesary and really just to veil little vendettas.

You know, as much as this may surprise many, I'd like you all to treat Gorb like a real human being, despite any misgivings you have, in particular you, Riku. If you can't have a proper conversation with a guy who presents logical counter arguments, even if you feel they are biased one way or another, then this place isn't much of a forum, it' more of a circlejerk about how much we all hate DoW III. Boo hoo.

The attacks and snide remarks about "Oh no X you're wrong about Y because of [arbitrary factor] you stupid ****" stop now.

Back to topic, and play nicely.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Psycho » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 4:57 pm

Gorb wrote:It's all made-up. It's a work of fiction.


With made-up lore that they don't even bother to follow? If it's a terminator, it has to look like a terminator and behave like a terminator as the playerbase expects terminators to behave. You can use the 'it's fiction' argument all you want, but this is still a dev choice to explicitly go against what everyone expected terminators to be even though DoWI and DoWII had them behaving just as everyone thought they would.

If you're making a 40k game, it better look like a 40k game and play like a 40k game, otherwise why make it based on 40k?
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Gorbles » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 5:05 pm

See: gameplay trumps lore.

We're going in circles at this point, which is why we go back to my original post to Forestradio about people justifying the things they like to themselves while refusing to justify the things they don't like. Even when the things that they like and the things that they don't like are equally unrealistic.

"acts like a Terminator" is not up to you to decide on. You can rate it according to your own opinion, but that's it. Which is why I said it's opinion, and not fact. If you agree on that, there is nothing else to say.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Psycho » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 5:39 pm

If the gameplay trumps lore, why did DoWI and DoWII have them as the slow but tanky version instead of what we're going to have now?

You say gameplay trumps lore but this is removing the lore characteristic of terminators for absolutely no value in regards of gameplay.

It's not just about lore. It's not just about gameplay. It's about both, and where this is going to lead to, seeing as there is absolutely no evidence that gameplay will be harmed if terminators are kept as what they were in the previous instalments, as relic proved that they were able to implement them as such successfully not once but twice.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Ace of Swords » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 5:40 pm

I can't wait to have new LOTR films have jets, atomic bombs and guns, after all, it's a work of fiction it doesn't need to be coherent to the internal lore, does it?



Oh wait, everysingle universe has it's own rules, space marines are stronger tha GMs, which in dow2 translates in 3 men tacts squad being able to beat 9 men GM squads in both melee and ranged, terminators are supposed to be less mobile than normal power armor and that's translated in them having less rotation/movement speed in game and there's 0 reason to have gabriel angelos having terminator armor they could simply give him power armor + a jump pack, in short, you are objectively wrong and has shown by history all the greatest and most critically acclaimed series,books and videogames as well, have had perfect coherence within the universe they take place in and within the precently set rules.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Odysseus » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 6:24 pm

The only thing I would have personally wanted for DoW III, would be the ability to construct your army with a combination of features both from Total War and Tabletop. Then each faction would be able to differentiate between different chapters, craftworlds, klans, dynasties etc. as subfactions, with specific units, vehicles and commanders for each. Then, respecting the lore, each sub-faction would have their distinct appearances and gameplay style. Campaign-wise, I think the possiblity to engage in smaller or larger scale battles would have been nice. Skirmishes or full-scale wars, allowing to combine base-building from DOW I for the large scale war efforts, with the small tactical gameplay from DoW II reserved for the skirmishes. It would have been a dream come true, and probably warrant a worthy end to the DoW franchise, but I suppose I can keep dreaming.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby egewithin » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 6:31 pm

DoW 1 had slow Termies, haven't caused a back fire.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Nurland » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 6:57 pm

I have to say that I am bit curious about people liking the game because it is generic? I mean I do really like the more photorealistic approach of DoW 2 over this generic look... It is one of the reasons I still play the game. I honestly dislike DoW3 material so far because of this generic look. It doesn't look like their own product or very original. It just feels like devs have seen SC2 and MOBAs be successful and are just copying that.

Angelos moving animations and jumping is just bad. Also why does he throw his hammer in the air when he does a special? Again I feel like Relic is taking the route of not doing their own thing but copying other games.

I know ultimately Relics goal is to make money so copying successful games makes sense as they probably want their share of the people who are used to Blizzard games or MOBAs. For me though it feels a tad bit lazy to be frank.

I am a bit sceptical about it being more clear or easy to notice things with the new visuals... I mean it seemed rather messy to be honest. I know we are in pre-alpha so that most will most likely change.

The new cover system is an ok change... Though the old one would have been even better if properly polished/improved.

Dunno about the new very much larger scale. I suppose it just takes some getting used to and will be just fine.

I do reserve my judgement to the release of the game but these are my current feelings regarding DoW 3 and even though I mainly raise negative points, I am carefully optimistic about DoW 3
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Ar-Aamon » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 7:27 pm

Nurland wrote:Angelos moving animations and jumping is just bad. Also why does he throw his hammer in the air when he does a special? Again I feel like Relic is taking the route of not doing their own thing but copying other games.


Because

Grob wrote:See: gameplay trumps lore.



If this make any sense to you [in this specific context], please see your local doctor.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Lulgrim » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 8:06 pm

Tbh, Gorbles is right – 1) all of it is rather ridiculous fantasy to begin with, so asking for “realism” is a bit of a miss (I would genre it as “science fantasy” instead of “science fiction”) and 2) if gameplay reasons require Gaben to do fucking Ryūtsuisen to telegraph his special, then he’s gonna do Ryūtsuisen.

However, 1) I don’t really care if Termies can jump or not, I just think the particular thing they did looks stupid and unsuitable, and 2) I’m not buying the gameplay necessity at all, they probably just think it will sell more if it looks like DOTA2. This goes for the glitter as well – they say it’s for readability, but doesn’t it look like a fucking mess? (Too Much Everything™)
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Carnevour » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 9:04 pm

GG RERIC you don gofed again! Dirty MOBA and generic peasantry gameplay how could they allow such travesty for such a dedicated 100 man community of the most ELITE people the DoW games community has to offer. No RERIC you should make another over complicated, over buggy, unresponsive and badly designed game so that the only true master race can play.
I am actually curious how many of you will buy DoW3 after saying that you wont thats what interest me.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Odysseus » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 9:59 pm

Yes, according to contemporary standards on fictional work, Warhammer 40k can be considered quite ridiculous. However, I will mention again, Warhammer 40k takes itself very serious. If it is carefully explained in the novels and the codices that Terminator armour turns you into a walking tank that has very poor mobility, but phenomenal durability and acces to greater firepower, in which you simply cannot jump around like a kangaroo because a tank cannot jump, then you should respect this when designing terminators. It defies logic and reason when not done so, which in this regard, even Warhammer 40k adheres to. I don't see why Relic sacrificed this crucial aspect of terminators for the sake of ''playability''. In my opinion, both DoW I and DoW II were fine games overall concerning playability. If they had simply perfected the formula and the issues both DoW 1 and DoW 2 had brought along, but nay, instead, they decided to remove it altogether (Cover system and the survivability of your troops instead of this instagibbing fest).

Most MOBAs are free to play these days. Don't forget that you will be paying full price for this game that looks and will probably play like a MOBARTS hybrid. I have nothing against Relic, I loved both DoW & DoW II to death, but this is a step back, and not only a step back, but also a step away from the depressing and grimdark universe of Warhammer 40k.

Also, I have to agree with Lulgrim's last points. There is so much flashiness and gibbed bits of gore everywhere that it looks more like a painting canvas of red and blue on the lens of my eye than a proper grimdark slog. Angelos sweeps his hammer around with that shield ability, and you can barely see him because of all the yellow. I do not understand where this ''units need to pop more on screen, better overall visibility'' idea comes from. Even MOBAs rarely have these exagerrated, bollywood-styled special effects, because the pros complain about such things.

It's not a bad thing per se, to have your game take inspiration from MOBAs for gameplay. I find MOBAs to have some very interesting concepts when it comes to gameplay, that could almost feel like a match made in heaven for Warhammer 40k heroes if you think about it. However, the artstyle is a completely different story. Warhammer 40k is not flexible with its artstyle. It's like Rembrandt suddenly decided to paint abstract or impressionist art. No, it would just not make any sense. Warhammer 40k has survived and come this far exactly because of its grimdarkness and as I would like to state again, changing this will always be a step back, and a step away from the 40K universe itself.

PS. I might buy the game if it gets overhauled, or otherwise, just for a giggle when its price has been lowered and the game has been polished.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Atlas » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 10:57 pm

This conversation about jumping Terminators has just gotten so absurd.

Basic question- if all of those jumps were replaced by mini-Teleports much like we have now in ELITE with the OM Terminators, will you all just go suddenly silent?
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Dark Riku » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 11:18 pm

Atlas wrote:Basic question- if all of those jumps were replaced by mini-Teleports much like we have now in ELITE with the OM Terminators, will you all just go suddenly silent?
Yes :) For that part anyway :)
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Lulgrim » Wed 15 Jun, 2016 11:22 pm

Carnevour wrote:GG RERIC you don gofed again! Dirty MOBA and generic peasantry gameplay how could they allow such travesty for such a dedicated 100 man community of the most ELITE people the DoW games community has to offer.

Exactly what are you trying to say here? People in this community are not allowed an opinion? Is it voided by playing DoW2 too much? Or playing the mod? Or do you need to be in a 1,000 man community? 10,000? Does it surprise you that people frequenting a DoW2 forum 7 years after release would specifically like DoW2?

Carnevour wrote:No RERIC you should make another over complicated, over buggy, unresponsive and badly designed game so that the only true master race can play.

I’d be cool with an overcomplicated game without the bugs and unresponsiveness, if by “overcomplicated” you mean directional cover and damage types. Also a one-armed monkey has the required capacity for playing DoW2 so I’m not sure what the master race thing is about. I couldn’t play a conventional RTS against people to save my life.

Carnevour wrote:I am actually curious how many of you will buy DoW3 after saying that you wont thats what interest me.

I actually read through the thread and one user has said they will not buy it (another was ambiguous/contradictory about it).
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Lost Son of Nikhel » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 12:17 am

Maybe its because I'm a bit older, but with every gameplay video I see, my hype decreases more and more. I don't like any of the aspects of the DOW III. For the Dark Gods hate, even the trailer its awful for me. Worse in every way compared to the DOW II one for me.

Ill wait and see how it's going to evolve, but ATM I'm not going to buy it
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Forestradio » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 1:23 am

Gorb wrote:to my original post to Forestradio about people justifying the things they like to themselves while refusing to justify the things they don't like. Even when the things that they like and the things that they don't like are equally unrealistic.
Say what? It was established through real life examples and some basic physics that terminators jumping and things exploding into pieces were two totally separate things, unless you were talking about the plasma/grav weapon discussion, please clarify.
Ace of Swords wrote:I can't wait to have new LOTR films have jets, atomic bombs and guns
Let's be honest now, Tolkien made the eagles pretty OP, it would only make sense to update LOTR and give Mordor some jets to take them down.
Carnevour wrote:RERIC you should make another over complicated, over buggy, unresponsive and badly designed game
Are you implying that dow3 will be bug free on release? LOL
Atlas wrote:Basic question- if all of those jumps were replaced by mini-Teleports much like we have now in ELITE with the OM Terminators, will you all just go suddenly silent?
No, we would move on to other stupid things, but it would be a start.
Also, there is a teleport assault present in a dow2 campaign that would be very fitting for just such an ability, however I will allow you to discover it on your own.
While we're at it, a teleport assault is probably easier to make since the animators don't have to animate all the jumping (which they did a bad job of anyways), as well as fitting the lore better, so why didn't they just do that again?

For the rest, see Nurland's and Odysseus' posts.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Caeltos » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 3:51 am

No, we would move on to other stupid things, but it would be a start.
Also, there is a teleport assault present in a dow2 campaign that would be very fitting for just such an ability, however I will allow you to discover it on your own.
While we're at it, a teleport assault is probably easier to make since the animators don't have to animate all the jumping (which they did a bad job of anyways), as well as fitting the lore better, so why didn't they just do that again?


Regular Dawn of War 3 Terminators have a teleport-assault thing already. I'm sure it's a leap to give it more uniqueness and flavor to the character. Whilst it does break the lore quite abit, or peoples perception on the weight and flexibility of the Terminator armor, giving characters more sense of 'agility' also gives the creators more creative freedom in how they develop abilities, which can allow for more fun gameplay in return.

It's also very easy to spot on the battlefield - whereas if it shared similiar effects to say, a regular terminator teleport assault thing, it's much more harder to identify without resorting to color visual changes - which isn't something that you can spot dead-on. You could say, that imagine you're an average joe, and you're trying to identify abilities from one another.

Which ability is color blue, and which one is color yellow. (Two abilities that are very similiar, and the only distinguishable difference is the visual effect)
It becomes troublesome to memorize, whereas if they all have their own unique effect, it's more easy to identify and remember. Terminators teleport, Gabriel Leaps. Easier to understand, and memorize.

Even most games out in the market try to refrain from using identical abilities/visual effects even if it's a 'SIMPLE SOLUTION' because it's important for the players to be able to IDENTIFY what happend, and who did what, when and where.

Specifically even in Dawn of War 2, it was always a huge clusterfuck of abilities that shared similiar effects, and the graphics didn't help much to make it easier to identify things, eventho the visuals did look pretty 'grim and awesome' - it's not a good enviroment for some players to keep track of things, and if they can't keep track - they'll get frustrated. Having people get frustrated over those type of elements is never a good thing.

Are you implying that dow3 will be bug free on release? LOL

I don't think anyone believes in bug-free games in 2016. But it's more likely that the game can be more responsive, and they've got a clear direction what they want to do with this one, and they've got backed up with SEGA now, which can help fund to make a great game. Dawn of War 2 was rushed out of the gate, and was openly said to be an experiment of a game, and focused on the team-game elements. Hench, why we didn't even 2v2 at launch, we only had 1v1 and 3v3s, and the 3 commander elements of it. Relic was trying to make due with what they had, and I commend them for it.

This might be abit off-topic to some of the discussion - but I'd say it's some food for thought. The game might be taking more of a step back on the complication, for the sake of clarity. Abilities are easier to identify, key-units are more easily spotted on the battlefield. Whilst, our "beloved" cover system has been revamped and redone in a more simplistic manner - doesn't take away from the complexity of the game. It's been redirected onto more macro-management with the base-building.

I'd say, it's going on the route of 'Easy to learn, hard to master" element, instead of the 'Hard to learn, difficult to master' we've got in it's current state. I'd say they might have learned abit from the brutality of how their games are severely punishing to learn, due to the timings of the game, the economy system and speed things up abit as well.

But in return, by possibly speeding it up abit - we also get more of what we love about Warhammer in that sense, "we" want battles. And battles we shall recieve, and they'll be more gory then before, whilst not packing the 'grim' aspect to it's fullest - it does deliver on massive battles, carnage great visual effects and quality voice acting, and hopefully be alot of fun.

If you're sceptical about the game - that's fine. I may not be 100% onboard, but I'm hopeful and I'm just looking forward to more footage and maybe convert me whole-heartedly. It's pre-alpha, alot is going to change.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Gorbles » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 9:53 am

Sorcerer wrote:If the gameplay trumps lore, why did DoWI and DoWII have them as the slow but tanky version instead of what we're going to have now?

You say gameplay trumps lore but this is removing the lore characteristic of terminators for absolutely no value in regards of gameplay.

It's not just about lore. It's not just about gameplay. It's about both, and where this is going to lead to, seeing as there is absolutely no evidence that gameplay will be harmed if terminators are kept as what they were in the previous instalments, as relic proved that they were able to implement them as such successfully not once but twice.

You're right, it is about both. But there's more than one way to skin a rabbit . . . or however that phrase goes. I mean I was specifically talking about Cataphractii-Overlord-Magos Gabriel and his jumping exploits, if you wanted me to just discuss the Terminator's pace of movement that's kinda another thing entirely.

However, just because DoW 1 and DoW II did things one way, that's no reason why DoW III can't do things another way. DoW 1 handled bolter fire differently to DoW II. DoW 1 had Khornate Sorcerers. DoW 1 had 100 Baneblades. DoW 1 had Boreale and all that entailed. There are plenty of ways to handle any specific scenario with the 40k IP. There's more than one right answer depending on the design goals of the game, given the flexibility of the lore behind it.

It's not a matter of "implementing it successfully", it's "maybe the Terminators need to be faster as an Elite line-breaking unit within the context of DoW II gameplay". But we don't know yet. It could even be "this is sped-up easy mode for a Campaign preview in a pre-alpha version of the product". Movement speed is easy to change. Balance will be non-existent at this stage.

I mean, you're voicing your concerns (and there've been some excellent posts in this thread overnight, with some great suggestions for Relic - I think the teleport-jump is one that a lot of people would like), absolutely fine. But there's no "right" or "wrong" way to approach this. I made design decisions in Firestorm over Kronus that weren't always 100% true to the lore, and there were fights about it. But sometimes serious compromises were needed not just to get the mechanics playable in the mod, but also to keep the feel of the gameplay intact. It didn't matter if something was (vaguely) balance and true to lore if it absolutely sucked to play with and nobody ended up picking it. You guys have ELITE, so I hope you appreciate where I'm coming from with this. We've all had that bit of experience at playtesting something and iterating it until it felt right.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Ar-Aamon » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 10:22 am

Arch pretty much nailed it with this video.

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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Odysseus » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 2:44 pm

Excellent video. He explains our thoughts with a more neutral approach, even though his frustration is very clear.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Nurland » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 3:01 pm

I honestly thing you can make Angelos' special jump attack somersault überstrike noticeable even with an assault teleport (maybe wind up with noticeable visuals before teleporting or after). Or just go for some other more lore friendly route. Heck, screw lore. Just make it not look stupid.

I am most likely going to buy the game. Doesn't mean I can't be critical about the new direction they are taking that doesn't seem entirely convincing. It has good stuff in it. Not even trying to deny that but it has some stuff that I honestly do not like and I am entitled to my opinion.

What I want to see is how the fighting goes player vs player. It is all what counts to me in the end. If it is enjoyable, I can live with visuals I dislike. If it is boring and unoriginal... I might end up not buying the game.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Ace of Swords » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 3:01 pm

Atlas wrote:This conversation about jumping Terminators has just gotten so absurd.

Basic question- if all of those jumps were replaced by mini-Teleports much like we have now in ELITE with the OM Terminators, will you all just go suddenly silent?


for gabriel angelos? Like I said it makes more sense to give him a jump pack + power armor, it's not a new thing for force commander since they can be equipped with it in the TT.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby egewithin » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 3:15 pm

Ace of Swords wrote:for gabriel angelos? Like I said it makes more sense to give him a jump pack + power armor


I agree with Ace. Force Commanders don't wear Termie armors very often no matter how high rank they ever are, being speedy and durable in the same time is far more important than a big flat armor. It is a pretension for Grey Knight commanders and Chaos Lords, that is all.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Caeltos » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 4:05 pm

But Gabriel Angelos is not a Force Commander, he is the Chapter Master of the Blood Ravens. Chapter Masters are pretty the top of the hierarchy of the ranks for the specific chapters. They dorn the most prestigeful armor - hell, pretty much whatever they like.

SO IT DOES make sense for him to gear-up from his former equipment. Still sporting inferior equipment when he is responsible for the Blood Ravens would make him an easy target, and you don't want your WIP to run around naked.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Ace of Swords » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 4:22 pm

Caeltos wrote:But Gabriel Angelos is not a Force Commander, he is the Chapter Master of the Blood Ravens. Chapter Masters are pretty the top of the hierarchy of the ranks for the specific chapters. They dorn the most prestigeful armor - hell, pretty much whatever they like.

SO IT DOES make sense for him to gear-up from his former equipment. Still sporting inferior equipment when he is responsible for the Blood Ravens would make him an easy target, and you don't want your WIP to run around naked.


Wrong, TT Marneus Calgar has options for both power and terminator armor and the marines always outfit with the required gear for the mission terminator armor is rarely used.
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Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby Cyris » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 4:27 pm

When I look at Gabriel in these videos I don't see a Terminator, I see Gabriel. By having no helmet on, by overflowing with color, personality, VO, name recognition and his clearly exagerated size I willingly put aside my expectations of a Terminator and focus on Gabriel the bad-ass leader with a thunderhammer. And what do I see his skills doing? Being a bad-ass front line leader with a thunderhammer.

By contrast, the Terminators I see in the videos have no such character. They wear helmets and are normal sized, and act exactly like I expect Terminators too.

I get why this bugs people. Oversized hero is clearly not "realistic", nor is the agility he displays relative to the encumbrance level of the armor he's drawn in. It's just that for me, and likely many others, he's Gabriel the hammerhero, not a Terminator. And he looks like tons of fun!
hiveminion
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Posts: 267
Joined: Fri 09 Aug, 2013 1:02 pm

Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby hiveminion » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 5:07 pm

I don't understand why they're taking this risk, alienating half of their fanbase with this cartoony, over-the-top artstyle and dumbed down, immersionless gameplay, obviously to cater to a broader audience that is still most likely to ignore the game. If they do succeed in selling 40k to a wider public then kudoes to them, even if it's a diluted parody of what 40k is supposed to be.

EDIT:
Regarding the discussion of 'realism' in sci-fi etc.:

Of course you can argue that Terminators might be able to summersault because 'it's a sci-fi fantasy realm with space elves and laser beams yaddayadda', but that is a really cheap argument that goes beside the point.
Sci-fi/fantasy universes have their own realism, that is defined by their canon material. Darth Vader can't fly. Gandalf can't one-shot a balrog with his staff. You can't teleport onto the Enterprise when its shields are up. And Terminators can't jump. You are free to disregard those things, as it's all just fiction, but then you're altering the realism of the fictional universe, and creating fan-fiction. And most fan-fictions are liked a whole lot less than their original source material.
Last edited by hiveminion on Thu 16 Jun, 2016 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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egewithin
Level 5
Posts: 1144
Joined: Mon 26 Jan, 2015 7:08 pm

Re: First ingame video (it's in German though)

Postby egewithin » Thu 16 Jun, 2016 5:15 pm

Image
HELBRECHT - Chapter Master of Black Templars

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DANTE - '' '' of Blood Angels

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KYRAS - '' '' of Blood Ravens ( Kılled while he was a giant deamon. )

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PEDRO KANTOR - '' '' of Crimson Fists

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AZRIEL - '' '' of Dark Angels

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GABRIEL SETH - '' '' of Flesh Tearers

And the list can go on.

You are right about they can wear whatever they want. But even first founding Chapter Masters don't see a must for wearing them. And of course, there are Termie armour Chapter masters too like Asterion Moloc of Minotaurs or Angelos of now. Still, that doesn't change the fact that 80% (?) of Force Commanders and chapter masters wears power armour because they care about being effective in a fight.

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